Discussion : Singapore Property

[Haolian King]

Singapore is indeed a competitive and relatively stressful place to live in. I think everyone agrees. Say for a 5rm hdb in Clementi costs abt S$500k now, but I can buy 2 units of 3-storeys terrace house i KL, M'sia, prob a palace in India. Same goes for things like food and necessities.

However, we were born here and we have to live with it. The only thing we can do is to crack our brains to make more money, or alternatively choose to migrate to other parts of the world. It is useless to complain too much as most policies won't change even if you complain non stop.

Btw I still still with my mum in her hdb flat with my wife. We wanted to buy a house (Condo or hdb) for 3 years now but cannot seems to find one. Not eligible for brand new hdb, condo too overpriced, resale hdb not worth buying with the current pricing. How?

[sandisk7]

Just my 2 cents…

Many are masked by the govt’s promise of asset enhancement. True, you make a little profit by selling what you bought many years ago, but a similar replacement is often even more costly. What’s the point if it means moving to the suburbs for that money? So unless you bought many units many years ago, you are not going to benefit from the asset appreciation. And how many common people is able to do it?

Tell me, would you rather purchase a $500k condo, pay off easily and then start accumulating your wealth (CPF, cash) or would you prefer to pay $1m for that same condo which will take more than twice the effort to own?

Someone mentioned “I believe that it doesn't matter if you bought high, it matters if your property can never sell high.....” I certainly agree with the statement but the main driver of the price appreciation “should” comes from the population growth and inflation if it is to be sustainable in the long run. The fact that many bought multiple properties with a view to make money points to a more speculative situation instead as the real source (first time buyers) seems to be priced out.

PM already noted that Singaporeans are not reproducing enough, how is the price increase going to be sustainable in the long run? Govt has been “artificially” generating population growth through influx of FTs, but these FTs would return home if Singapore loses its competitive edge and we do not have a lot of bargaining power left since our tax structure is already one of the lowest in the world. We even have to resort to the IRs which was unthinkable a decade back.

Lastly, property prices affect everything – it directly affects the cost of doing businesses (rents form a major portion) as therefore the cost of living. I am fine with the price increase so long that the appreciation is in-line with salary increase/general inflation.

[jazz_samz]

Buying a house in other countries is like buying some fancy LSP. Buy at a discount. After some time when you want to sell, sell cheap cheap also nobody wants....

hahha. I like this comparison.

[116520]

I support you jamhoe...

Buying a house in sg is just like buying 116520. Buy at a premium. Some bought it at $15k, some at $16k, some at $17k... no matter at which level, I believe that in long term, if you sell it later in your life, I am sure you will cover the cost or even make $ from it.

Buying a house in other countries is like buying some fancy LSP. Buy at a discount. After some time when you want to sell, sell cheap cheap also nobody wants....

don understand why there are so many people complaining houses pricing high. the fact is that a large % of singaporeans make $$ through selling houses either thru HDB or private.
i am sure u ask ur parent, surely most of them or even all of them made quite a fair bit for selling their old house.
i am sure whoever buy at so-call "HIGH PRICE'' now will eventually make $$ a few years later, if not blame it on your own 'kiasuness' or lack of foresight to invest.
life is like this...you win some, you lose some....
at lease we are a group of fortunate ppl who can collect watches and most even drives nice cars.

[jamhoe2]

don understand why there are so many people complaining houses pricing high. the fact is that a large % of singaporeans make $$ through selling houses either thru HDB or private.
i am sure u ask ur parent, surely most of them or even all of them made quite a fair bit for selling their old house.
i am sure whoever buy at so-call "HIGH PRICE'' now will eventually make $$ a few years later, if not blame it on your own 'kiasuness' or lack of foresight to invest.
life is like this...you win some, you lose some....
at lease we are a group of fortunate ppl who can collect watches and most even drives nice cars.

[116520]

I totally agree with pet and jazz's comments. Public housing is very important to the lower income group of sg. However, I think they shouldn't be complaining too much now. For people who has purchased HDB a few years ago and if they are permitted to sell now, I am sure they can earn big bucks. For those who haven't purchase any, too bad. I feel that they shouldn't complain about the increase in price, can't afford lah, things like that.... if some ppl can afford it, why can't they afford it??? Blame it on the govt, blame it on the FT, why don't they look at themselves? See how to improve themselves, upgrade themselves, in order to increase their income level to match current standard of living.

pet, you mentioned about how small the new hdb are built these days and many ppl living in 3-room. If you talk to our MM, ppl in the 50s, 60s, the living conditions were far worse than now. Houses in sg is so much more bigger than houses in places like hk, jp, etc... I think ppl these dayz complains too much. But looking at it, with those complaints then we can realise we are making mistakes and life get better..... just my 2 cents.... hope not to offend anyone.... cheers!

[jazz_samz]

Honestly, property DID went up but places like HK, Beijing, shanghai, etc also went up. The question of "too late" is arguable. If property goes up a little and govt starts all measures then can we catch up with other markets? Don't forget that we are living a free world.

I believe that it doesn't matter if you bought high, it matters if your property can never sell high.....

Pardon me for not being more precise... I do refer to the measures for public housing.
I think its perfectly fine with pte housing prices to rise bcos that is not an area which addresses the maj population and social responsibility to the citizens.

However, I do agree with your comment "I believe that it doesn't matter if you bought high, it matters if your property can never sell high..... " which ultimately matters most.

Well, property prices for China infact appreciated sharply... does it mean its a good thing? NO! Should a country's inflation and basic expenses grow too sharply, there is no way for the general population to cope.... How many of the China citizens enjoy annual increment more or equal to the inflation or percentage of the property price increase. They are suffering and if you are in China to mingle with the middle class and below, they will tell you the same.... Should a country's economy grow too sharply, it may not be necessary be a good thing. Bcos their own citizen is unable to cope.
Catching up with other market should be secondary, after catering to the general population's ability, not for the sake of 'being up there with the big boys'....

My 2 cents worth only lah.... At the end of the day, how this affects me? Totally irrelevant. But it is my personal perspective for the average Singaporean...

[pet]

ya loh... one type of rice feed 100 diff type of ppl... hahhahaa

cannot make every1 happy...

for me....
it's public housing...if not controlled, future kanna social problem... cos some now might not be homeless, but alot of them squeeze into a 3rm etc...so current HDB policy ( whtever it is )... ... thot i am not into 1, but u see ppl complain .. chye chye leow... or u see MM warn against protest in regards to HDB policy, also chye chye leow... ... might not be a big issue, but it's a big issue to some... i jst look at it frm those bottom earner view

as for others, might be FT policy.. wow lau... tht i dont understand ...why singaporean complain against them.... really sound very racist, like MM said, they are human being, gv them a break...
to me alot of blanga or FT ppl complain abt = WP holder, which are low pay and very very low chance of becoming PR or citizen. these ppl are helping us to build our city... .. so we should gv them some respect.

[116520]

ha ha.... but arrest them need resources too...

cos hor, all kanna arrrested ... hahahhaa

[116520]

True, but pet, how many of us are not "lifetime-slaves" to our houses??? Not only in sg, it happens in other countries like hk, jp, etc.

Some of you might not agree with me. Personally, I feel that property-ownership is not a social problem, homeless is a social problem.

cos hor, all kanna arrrested ... hahahhaa

no lah, got rental mah

also cos not diff to own 1 mah... pay by the monthly force savings can leow ( cpf ) ... hahaa... but with price up, nothing left nia...hahaha

[pet]

Just a simple question, if supply is so limited, why I don't see many homeless people in sg as compared to other countries?

cos hor, all kanna arrrested ... hahahhaa

no lah, got rental mah

also cos not diff to own 1 mah... pay by the monthly force savings can leow ( cpf ) ... hahaa... but with price up, nothing left nia...hahaha

[116520]

Just a simple question, if supply is so limited, why I don't see many homeless people in sg as compared to other countries?

[pet]

you need to read in between the lines when i say someone.

some1 = me, also make abit

but some big big 1 up there make even more

[triton]

you need to read in between the lines when i say someone.

so bottom line like triton say, some1 make money... but hor at the expense of those who cant...cant afford to own 1 in the first place to make money... hahaha....

[pet]

true tht other country also up....i stay in private prop... private prop depend on market, can go hi...... but hor... public housing depend on gov... so it should within reach and controllable for majority......

me middle age.. of cos pay abit of attention to hdb frm 1990 to current.
some hdb things i notice ( i might be wrong in some cases .. correct me )

early 90s, bishan exe flat only 130k nia.

late 90s, 4rm jurong near mrt abt 130k nia.

90s build so many, also got new town. choices and supply alot. mainly 4 and 5 rm.

since 90s houses getting smaller

last 4 - 5 yrs, hdb up price give excuse and say subsidy = market resale less discount.

since 2005.. build alot of even smaller flats studio, 2rm,3rm.

last few yrs, alot of 'incoming' .. yet no increase in new flat.
if incoming buy resale... price up... hdb new price also up, since hdb base on market less subsidy..

current supply not enough to meet demand... look at the application rate over available for sale. hdb saying they building 10k to 15k ? if it's true, izzit enough ???

BTO flats ? wow lau... empty piece of land ( nice patch of grass ). ask ppl apply thn build... wow .. wait at least 3yrs...according to their bto condition ( possible up to 5yrs wait ).

notice eg. cantonment rd flats are release many many yrs bck.. and they release for sale again last yr ... same goes to queenstown, my frd got a flat ( 4rm at 300k 3 yrs back ).... they release again for sale at 400k 2yrs bck...Question is, why they release in phrase.... ?? trying to 'fry fry' market. public housing should not be use for speculation, but yet same blk and place, hdb delay release and up price ( according to market rate ??).... is hdb trying to make more $$. ... note: end last yr release another new place at queenstown.. min 460k to 550k leow

there's lotsa way to control prices, too many ways... so it's up to gov if they want of not...

guess boh bien, whn economy grows... too many new smart a$s implementing new funny ideas, desgn build, bto, options, flat type etc...

some of us are lucky to hv a roof over our head...but looking at below ave income earner... really jia lark....so bottom line like triton say, some1 make money... but hor at the expense of those who cant...cant afford to own 1 in the first place to make money... hahaha....