Panerai overpriced?

[patricia]

i know why rolex and panerai so expensive liao!!! ...becos you can join the rolex and paneristi forums and be a part of the great community....

personally....i feel the paneristi community shares a great passion for their watches....

on top of that... their history and limited pieces will command a premium...simply supply and demand...

i love my rolex and pam equally....shhhh....dont let my wife hear me...

Then you buy one for your wife for the coming Christmas.I am sure she won't complain.

[keltzar]

Another factor at play is confidence in the brand. If I have confidence in the brand that the value will hold ... I will be willing to pay more for it. If I know that I will take a hit if/when I let it go, the pricing reflects this risk.

That's why the resale market is a good gauge of this ... and why people will pay more proportionate-to-new for say, a Rolex compared to a Longines. I like both brands, personelly ...

.... but I would hesitate less to buy, say, a new Airking for $4.5k than a solid-gold Longines for $4.3k ... because the former you can resell for $3k ... but latter, about $1.5k. Just an example.

[wiliercento]

pam

I love PP, AP, Pam, Lolek, IWC...

In absolute material and labour terms, all overpriced I see. Even those collectible 500K, 1M watches. Can feed starving villages.

Brand is intangible, it lies in demand. More people wants = higher value.

All the brands are trying to create and maintain values by different strategy.

If you feel Song paying then not overprice because you enjoy the ownership. A 16K Birkin bag is grossly overpriced if you ask me. But many are happy to enjoy the ownership experience, exclusivity created by the brand.

When nobody is willing to part below a certain amount, thats the value. Nobody will part with a 16610 or 111 below 5K, for eg, as there are willing buyer at higher price. Thus selling at 10K I say overprice, but some are willing to pay more for the time of ownership, like 312 now over list.

Market opinion is diverse or many brands will fold. Each have their fans just like soccer.

Its a no end debate. Good coffee talk.

So 80c or $5 coffee?

[feilong108]

buy what you fancy can liao..

[Ray_Watches]

I love PP, AP, Pam, Lolek, IWC...

In absolute material and labour terms, all overpriced I see. Even those collectible 500K, 1M watches. Can feed starving villages.

Brand is intangible, it lies in demand. More people wants = higher value.

All the brands are trying to create and maintain values by different strategy.

If you feel Song paying then not overprice because you enjoy the ownership. A 16K Birkin bag is grossly overpriced if you ask me. But many are happy to enjoy the ownership experience, exclusivity created by the brand.

When nobody is willing to part below a certain amount, thats the value. Nobody will part with a 16610 or 111 below 5K, for eg, as there are willing buyer at higher price. Thus selling at 10K I say overprice, but some are willing to pay more for the time of ownership, like 312 now over list.

Market opinion is diverse or many brands will fold. Each have their fans just like soccer.

Its a no end debate. Good coffee talk.

So 80c or $5 coffee?

[Watcha]

I love PP, AP, Pam, Lolek, IWC...

In absolute material and labour terms, all overpriced I see. Even those collectible 500K, 1M watches. Can feed starving villages.

Brand is intangible, it lies in demand. More people wants = higher value.

All the brands are trying to create and maintain values by different strategy.

If you feel Song paying then not overprice because you enjoy the ownership. A 16K Birkin bag is grossly overpriced if you ask me. But many are happy to enjoy the ownership experience, exclusivity created by the brand.

When nobody is willing to part below a certain amount, thats the value. Nobody will part with a 16610 or 111 below 5K, for eg, as there are willing buyer at higher price. Thus selling at 10K I say overprice, but some are willing to pay more for the time of ownership, like 312 now over list.

Market opinion is diverse or many brands will fold. Each have their fans just like soccer.

Its a no end debate. Good coffee talk.

So 80c or $5 coffee?

[ckhouse80]

watch overprice will create more demand... value will increase also

[Fred_Tan]

Back to the topic....Panerai overpriced?

Of course it is.
But no one says it's cheap.

And, no one ask or force you to buy.

No money, can always buy other cheaper watches.
There're many brands out there with better quality, technology innovation, precision & workmanship than Panerai and lower price than Panerai.

Take Grand Seiko for example.
It's workmanship & innovation far surpass even PP and cost much much less.
Make to last >20 years without major servicing.
And severely over-engineered to last forever.

If you got more $, then buying a steel PP Nautilus Jumbos 5711, 5712, 5980 is more worth it now, given the 30% price drop recently.
Nautilus is the range that started off high horlogerie de gamme luxury sports watch in 1970s. (Rolex is not high-horlogerie, fyi)
With just 300 - 700 pieces made per year per model & waiting list of >8 years, it's worth every penny now & next generation.

5980/1A-001 is e most sought after stainless steel watch & e most expensive in-production steel watch.
This is followed by 5712/1A-001 & 5711/1A-001.

All other brands & models are just PP Nautilus wannabe....

[116520]

YAY!!! Sounds good! In return, we will wear our PAMs and let him molest them....

YAY! LOUIE BUY COFFEE AND LUNCH FOR EVERYONE ON THE FORUM!

[Ender]

okay lah bro, what about coffee o on me,lunch on you...

YAY! LOUIE BUY COFFEE AND LUNCH FOR EVERYONE ON THE FORUM!

[darth-khips]

Well I hate to say this.

Feel free do berate anyone at anytime.
It's a free forum.
Say watever you want.

You're expert man.
I dun wish to share anything w u.
Nor do I look forward to hear from you.

i dun berate, so again with your nonsense accusation. check your dictionary, berate means "to scold", kind hightlight how i "scolded" you or anyone??and you dun have to share anything u dun want to. it is a free forum, you can share your opinion, but you have to be FACTUAL. and contrary to your "say whatever you want" attitude, this is a free but public forum, thus one has to be sensitive to others, as a matter of courtesy. when pointed out factual errors, and presented with it, you still refuse to recognize them, and still insist you are right, or rubbish other makes; or sidestep them.

i didnt realize this, until another forumer pointed out to me, that you have been selling quite a few PAMs, thus it is rather surprising that you opine that panerai prices can only head north, and still you are divesting. and thus the overdefensiveness.

nevertheless, an olive branch, if not tree is still extended to you.

[AK]

Prices of any commodities is forcibly determined by the market - demand and supply.

While I am not taking sides of the prices ranges of Rolex or Panerai, in general, all watch companies in their establishing infant stages (should they want to be successful) will consider which entry price model to manufacture all the way up the pricier complications.

That said, a prevendome Panerai Ref. 5218-201/A was only 1500 EUR back in 1993, when Rolex lovers like you and I were thinking: "Who would want to wrist a clock the size of 44mm? Siao anot?" - many thought that way, those who had the sharp eye in predicting the "full-blown" scale of what 44mm and above sizes watches have impacted the horology market today will have made a ton considering a 201/A will cost in the price range of USD $ 35,000 - USD $ 40,000...some even asking 39,000 EUR. Go figure. Having said that, 201/A was produced in limited quanities...less than 1000 pieces worldwide.

Had Rolex gone the same route as their Double-Red / Single-Red Sea Dweller with less than 1000 pieces worldwide, there's no doubt that the prices of these Vintages will be off the top of the roof! Can some say realistically that it may cost $ 150,000 - $ 250,000 easily today? More perhaps, we will not know for this is a might-be-situation.

Panerai, having been bought over by Richemont group in 1997, went through a revamp in all areas. From their relocation of their Firenze, Florence factory right up to the marketing campaigns engaged with Sylvester Stallone in their Sly-Tech models offerings, I would say that Richemont was directing Officine Panerai in a profit-making direction, which would have happened slower if OP was still under Dino Zei. Panerai was officially staying in touch with the relevancy of other renowned watch brands, and getting stronger at it under Richemont.

Fast forward to today, Rolex has churned out the DeepSea Sea-Dweller, riding on the wave of big watches demand that Panerai, love it or hate it, has paved for the watch community worldwide. I am speaking from the perspectives and observations of the market reactions over the past 5 years.

Now, while I generally will not wrist any timepiece over 40mm (due to small wrists), I still have a couple of Panerai(s) under my belt - investments if you will. Prices have indeed jumped rapidly, especially with watch companies going to the extend of 2 price increases anually, this is evident that the market is still receptive to the brand.

We all have our limitations to what we can afford, utilize and waste. Let's not get personal in our comments towards what our current occupation is able to increase these limits. There can be a filthy rich tycoon who does not appreciate horology but wears a vintage Blancpain Fifty Fantoms not knowing the value of it since decades ago versus a corporate ladder-climbing executive who's exposed to all the watch brands, scrimping on every meal just to save pennies for a Rolex Sea Dweller, knowing well that this will be a worthwhile investment in the years to come. Interests play an underlying role into how we become attached to articles, particularly stainless steel encapsulating wonderous movements that will send cold and shivers up and down our spines, like how a Tudor Monte Carlo Ref 7032 in flesh (today) just did me.

In essence, there will never be price drops, and only price increases, if and only if the demand outstrips the supply which Panerai has been successful in doing by limiting supply on a yearly production basis. There will be minor fluctuations +/- like in any market, but chances are, in 10-20 years, whatever Panerai(s) out in the market will see double or triple jumps - that my friend is my prediction.

[116520]

Why got so pissed? Nothing is perfect... Peace man...

Well I hate to say this.

Feel free do berate anyone at anytime.
It's a free forum.
Say watever you want.

You're expert man.
I dun wish to share anything w u.
Nor do I look forward to hear from you.

[Nooch]

Well I hate to say this.

Feel free do berate anyone at anytime.
It's a free forum.
Say watever you want.

You're expert man.
I dun wish to share anything w u.
Nor do I look forward to hear from you.

Fred, very strong words u using here. A forum is not a place to berate anyone. It is to share e love of e items and knowledge. Its not a place to say watever u want, tats wat e Mods here are for.

one advice: 'Live and let live'

Cheers.

[Fred_Tan]

get lost

mate, dun be like that. this is exchange of views. there is no right or wrong opinions, just right or wrong facts.

i am more happy that you continue to contribute your horological knowledge. lets not make this personal. i would be more then happy to buy you a drink or meal, and listen to your opinions, serious. you definately know more about Panerai then me, becoz i am not a serious fan, i have not investigated pre V models, or even many current models, prob can learn more about individual models from you.

Well I hate to say this.

Feel free do berate anyone at anytime.
It's a free forum.
Say watever you want.

You're expert man.
I dun wish to share anything w u.
Nor do I look forward to hear from you.