buying rolex without certs.

[NewRollieBB]

Old models

Hi all, sorry if I sound random here. I was checking out the 26mm date just in duo tone with mother of pearl face and diamond dials.

But second hand dealer only has the older model (in the older version bracelet which buckle scratches easily).

It's because of the buckle that I'm contemplating. I was told that newer version costs approx. $2k more (which is a lot for only difference in bracelet).

Given a choice, would you rather pay more for the more scratch-proof newer version bracelet or pay less with older version bracelet? Buying for own use and not intending to trade. Just bought a new pc from AD last year so I'm looking at pre-owned for my second pc.

All feedback pertaining to pros and cons of the 2 different versions of bracelets. Btw, I'm referring to Jubilee bracelets.

[greeniewhite]

I do agreed. It is a safe guard that you are buying the real ones.

[Jakarta After Dark]

Useful info.. =)

Much obliged...

[DayDreaming]

The curious thing is that even if you pay RSC to authenticate a watch, they will not issue a Certificate of Authenticity even though the results of their review is that your watch is authentic.

I was just down at the local RSC over lunch time to have them check a circa-2001 WG DD with a rare blue jub arabic dial I had them authenticate. Just got it yest, though I have been lusting over the watch for some time already. Only thing that was holding me back was that I couldn't find that type dial on the internet or any Rolex catalog. However, yest decided to pull the trigger on that baby yest then this afternoon went over to the local RSC for authentication (watch came with no box or papers).

Whilst they were kind enough to do a physical/external check for free (after which they told me it looks authentic, which they say should give me 90% assurance it is authentic), I decided to dish out the extra wad to once and for all settle my curiousity about the watch's 100% authenticity. As it turns out, my hunch was right and it turned out not only to be authentic, but the dial was considered a special collector's model -- the dial was not in their 2001-2002 catalogs but they eventually found it in Rolex International's internal data base (which may be consistent with the fact that my dealer told me he bought it from an undisclosed VVIP). Nonetheless, they did not issue me a Certificate of Authenticity; not even their invoice for authenticating the watch will say it's for authentication, but would just reflect 'service charges'.

I am however comforted by the fact that to get that service invoice is tantamount to a certificate of authenticity as RSC will not service, much less accept for evaluation, any item that is not original (or original with non-Rolex after-market parts). This is why a service invoice (especially if it's quite recently dated) from RSC is good enough proof of a watch's authenticity, should you come across a vintage piece with incomplete documentation.

Useful info.. =)

[youngwarrior]

Thanks guys.. just wondering if the same applies to Tudor. I presume it should be the same...

[RTTL]

Well said.

[Jakarta After Dark]

The curious thing is that even if you pay RSC to authenticate a watch, they will not issue a Certificate of Authenticity even though the results of their review is that your watch is authentic.

I was just down at the local RSC over lunch time to have them check a circa-2001 WG DD with a rare blue jub arabic dial I had them authenticate. Just got it yest, though I have been lusting over the watch for some time already. Only thing that was holding me back was that I couldn't find that type dial on the internet or any Rolex catalog. However, yest decided to pull the trigger on that baby yest then this afternoon went over to the local RSC for authentication (watch came with no box or papers).

Whilst they were kind enough to do a physical/external check for free (after which they told me it looks authentic, which they say should give me 90% assurance it is authentic), I decided to dish out the extra wad to once and for all settle my curiousity about the watch's 100% authenticity. As it turns out, my hunch was right and it turned out not only to be authentic, but the dial was considered a special collector's model -- the dial was not in their 2001-2002 catalogs but they eventually found it in Rolex International's internal data base (which may be consistent with the fact that my dealer told me he bought it from an undisclosed VVIP). Nonetheless, they did not issue me a Certificate of Authenticity; not even their invoice for authenticating the watch will say it's for authentication, but would just reflect 'service charges'.

I am however comforted by the fact that to get that service invoice is tantamount to a certificate of authenticity as RSC will not service, much less accept for evaluation, any item that is not original (or original with non-Rolex after-market parts). This is why a service invoice (especially if it's quite recently dated) from RSC is good enough proof of a watch's authenticity, should you come across a vintage piece with incomplete documentation.

[Temasek2010]

Anyone knows will Rolex centre non local AD Rolex?

[shou.biao.kuang]

Actually, I have similar question too. I keep several antique watches and they have no papers/box and some parts are restored and replaced. Can I still go to the authorised dealers to have it authenticate and get some form of certification. Will that helps? What you think?

To the best of my understanding (I may not be 100% right), Rolex (RSC) will give a certificate (of service?) if you do an overhaul on the watch. Some folks used that as a form of "paper" for their watches as they may have lost the original paper. I have seen numerous sellers using this method to gain confident from the buyers.

[youngwarrior]

Actually, I have similar question too. I keep several antique watches and they have no papers/box and some parts are restored and replaced. Can I still go to the authorised dealers to have it authenticate and get some form of certification. Will that helps? What you think?

I don't think so, if not, most folks who had lost their papers would have had them replaced, hence there won't be the without-papers issue.

[shou.biao.kuang]

ok guys, I know this might be a little off tangient, but I was wondering if it was at all possible to replace the paperwork on the watch.
Like if you lose your birthcert in a fire or something, you can get it replaced.
Was wondering if it was the same for watches?

I don't think so, if not, most folks who had lost their papers would have had them replaced, hence there won't be the without-papers issue.

[shou.biao.kuang]

the paper will add value in time to come (not within 5 years). also some will prefer complete set. for me, my 6694 collection all comes with box and certification. maybe it is just me. but i feel that without box and certification, the watch package is not complete.

in the past, most buyers just keep the watch and throw away the box and cert because they dont mean alot back then. but try finding say a paul newman daytona aka daytona with zenith movement with certification is hard. this is what makes the watch collectible to me because there is possible about ~25k of such watches ever produced. even harder to find is a oysterquartz with paper.

to me, i will always look for a complete package, watch, cert, box. anything less, i am likely to give it a miss unless i really got no choice

I would agree with Triton on the "completeness" of a Rolex, together with all the correct braclet, case number, series number and even the box itself, especially for serious vintage collector. Its everything to them!

For vintage collectors, like the model mentioned above (Paul Newman Daytona) its almost "impossible" or rather difficult to find one set with everything matching from head to toe. And if there ever exist one like that, complete in its totality, it is sure to command much higher price than one without, assuming condition and age etc are held constant...

And I don't know since when everyone starts to keep the certs and boxes due to this "completeness" thingy compared to what Triton mentioned above, where folks used to throw away the boxes, certs, etc...

[edwinwan]

ok guys, I know this might be a little off tangient, but I was wondering if it was at all possible to replace the paperwork on the watch.
Like if you lose your birthcert in a fire or something, you can get it replaced.
Was wondering if it was the same for watches?

[tampines]

ok, veri interesting to know ! tks

[ngokyc]

Apart from the resale value, I think it is ok to buy one without cert. Like the rest of the forumers mentioned, condition, price, original parts etc affect the purchase of a preowned piece.