Panerai Price Dropping!

[Fred_Tan]

Not necessary rounded, sometimes can be sharp as well

This I agree, cos got a trader told me can always polish and post its LNIB and unworn after that and sell much higher

but for the inexperienced, its really hard to tell when a watch had been repolished. Most buyers only look at price and honestly, you cant blame them for doing so. Its been mentioned that unless you know the grey dealer very well, its better to buy from ADs whom will not shortchange you in such a way.


Is it true that after 1 polish, the effect is prettry obvious? I mean, would it really take off a lot of the metal and cause a bit of thining, resulting in the rounding corners that you mentioned

Like the bottom of lugs on 1950 case, a very slight polishing at Richemont will make it slightly sharp.
More polish & it will be even sharper...

But on e top of e lugs, a very slight polish will result in roundings.
More deeper polish will make it rounder.

Richemont will guarantee 70% case, lugs, back plate / ring shape & brushed texture will not be lost.
Meaning every time u send a watch to Havelock Rd, u lose 30%.

This mean bottom lug will get sharper & sharper.
While e top will get rounder with each polish.

For a Luminor, bottom & top of e lugs will get rounder.
For Rad, it's e hardest to see....dunno where to see oso, LOL

[Fred_Tan]

Chia lat

Ah Beng oso know IWC, PP, OP, AP, Lange, JLC liao...
I must be very suaku

[exxondus]

that is a figure of speech..... :P

ok lah, guess i was just being petty haha...kk got your point..anyway, just wanna let it rest since both he and I already typed our views. If you see fit, can delete my post so that it might not be used as fuel in future by mistake.

This is a great and enjoyable forum as well as informative. wanna keep it that way rather than become a war zone....

Cheers!

[ohlins]

the rest I cant really rem but barking at the wrong tree sounds to me like indirectly calling me a dog? No? nm just forget it.

that is a figure of speech..... :P

[exxondus]

will i get to buy pam 233 @ 14.5k below? last year want to buy 16k. now i heard 14.5k can buy. if can hor, 1.5k savings. can buy more straps.

triton bro, hobbylink got a 233 listed at 14,350 only.

taken from their webbie:


"
K Series Panerai PAM 233 GMT 8 day Movement 1950


Movement: hand-wound mechanical, Panerai Calibre P.2002, completely manufactured by Panerai, second time zone, 8-day power reserve, 24h indicator, second reset device. Case: diameter 44 mm, brushed steel. Bezel: polished steel. Back: see-through sapphire crystal. Crystal: sapphire, made from corundum, 2 mm thick. Anti reflective coating. Water-resistance: 100 meters. Strap: calf with Panerai personalised steel large-size buckle. Supplied with a steel screwdriver and a second interchangeable rubber strap. Very mint condition like new, Box and open papers, selling $14,350
"

Not sure if hobbylink is like Jwatch where you need to add GST thou. Preowned but below your 14.5k. all the best if you getting!!

[exxondus]

i am not trying to defend Fred.... but in this thread, he did not use the word "arrogant" against any member....

oh i my bad, i cant rem all the things he called me. I beleve its ignorant and not arrogant.

the rest I cant really rem but barking at the wrong tree sounds to me like indirectly calling me a dog? No? nm just forget it.

barking at the wrong tree

Meaning

Making a mistake or a false assumption in something you are trying to achieve.

Origin

The allusion is to hunting dogs barking at the bottom of trees where they mistakenly think their quarry is hiding.

and whats with the issue that as long as anything is something that he doesnt know, e.g. transactions,. pricing that he wasnt aware, its considered wrong and he has a wrong to shoot down? just curious thats all.

[feilong108]

hey...y the mention about ah bengs only know about rolexes???i am 1 of the ang kong beng who know about brands other than rolex ok....u have something against ah bengs?

Hehehehe..relax guys....chillout....just a forum and no need to defend here and there....

[ohlins]

That I feel is really uncalled for. You can correct them and share your experience if you wish, but to call people arrogant and giving baseless facts, barking at wrong tree, is really a bit too attacking.

i am not trying to defend Fred.... but in this thread, he did not use the word "arrogant" against any member....

[Fred_Tan]

Stop buying Panerai

Told my friends PAM is a fashion watch... looks like I am right pricing falling due 2 no demand... kekekeke

PAM quality also cannot beat ROLEX or PTAEK... NO WAY!

You are right.
Who would be stupid enough to pay SGD35k for a PAM217 2 years ago that comes with a SGD150 ETA6497/2 mvmt?

It's a fashion fad that even Rolex is trying to follow with 43mm DSSD.

Patek is the best.
Their watch has the best quality even when u see many more complaints bout malfunctions & very slow service in many forum like PuristSPro.
They hand-made everything.
Last watch company to be family owned.

AP oso very good.
JLC oso good.
IWC very good.
Glashutte very very good.
Lange even better.
Hublot very very good.
Grand Seiko very very very good.
Rolex is da BEST!

PAM very bad.
No advertisement in any major dailies worldwide.
Uncle & aunties dun even know that it is not a SGD100 watch.
U wear PAM, ppl think u poor & no standard as the Beng & Seng only know Rolex.
Exhorbitant pricing.
Thanks to bad flippers like me who caused it.
Pawnshop dun eat some more.
I think pawnshop will laugh at me till his fake teeth drops out if I bring in my 217 & tell him I bought it for SGD9k 2yrs ago and now it's at least 21k.

PAM is a fashion fad which will fade next year.
Pls dun buy any PAM.
I will be happi if this happen when every1 shun PAM.
At least I can buy PAMs on e cheap then.
I wan a 21, 203 & 267 for less than 20k in total...

[exxondus]

There are many traders here who recycle pre-owned watch and make it into LNIB & even BNIB...

If u dun believe me, just pay e 2 polishing shops a visit on ur off-days or Sat esp around 2pm & see who visit there with all e watches to polish...

Such traders have been caught by many members in P.com in Spore who have same case & bezel to compare.

When u see sharp corners that are too sharp & even rounded corners when it's not suppose to be....u know what u r in for....

These traders are getting good references from e very group ppl who polish the watches a swell as their trolls & moles...
Some of em even visit cybercafes to create logins in forum with different IPs to post fake inflated WTS price & fake demand by posting fake WTBs.

And, you call these ppl good traders...I know who they are as they have been banned in many forums.
Sadly, some are still not caught as it's very hard to prove their deeds.

I stand proud to say, I never sell watches that mis-claim a condition.
All my watches works fine.
I scrutize my items to the best of my ability which is not much.
I can put a case & bezel next to my watch with a 100x high powered loupe and compare the polished & brushed grain by grain.
My photos speak for myself.

These traders are still in business & u kind of guessed who they are when everything from them BNIB or LNIB.
U hardly see Pre-owned sale offer from them.

A very low profile but well known collector here was accidentally offered a BNIB watch by one of these trader here that's actually a pre-owned watch that he sold to a fren who later sold to this trader...it has e same miilesimation, LOL

Now, not all traders are bad.
Not all traders with good references are good.

Good traders dun even need to post to sale.
His watches are already sold even b4 they arrive.

My point here is how do u judge the pricing here from traders like these?
I exclude all these ppl from my pricing.
I visit em for e fun of knowing what these ppl have.

I offer every1 here my free service to come along w u if u need to buy from any grey-trader here...I can help u snuffed out who these traders are...
I am here to share...

This I agree, cos got a trader told me can always polish and post its LNIB and unworn after that and sell much higher

but for the inexperienced, its really hard to tell when a watch had been repolished. Most buyers only look at price and honestly, you cant blame them for doing so. Its been mentioned that unless you know the grey dealer very well, its better to buy from ADs whom will not shortchange you in such a way.


Is it true that after 1 polish, the effect is prettry obvious? I mean, would it really take off a lot of the metal and cause a bit of thining, resulting in the rounding corners that you mentioned

[Fred_Tan]

Careful out there

There are many traders here who recycle pre-owned watch and make it into LNIB & even BNIB...

If u dun believe me, just pay e 2 polishing shops a visit on ur off-days or Sat esp around 2pm & see who visit there with all e watches to polish...

Such traders have been caught by many members in P.com in Spore who have same case & bezel to compare.

When u see sharp corners that are too sharp & even rounded corners when it's not suppose to be....u know what u r in for....

These traders are getting good references from e very group ppl who polish the watches a swell as their trolls & moles...
Some of em even visit cybercafes to create logins in forum with different IPs to post fake inflated WTS price & fake demand by posting fake WTBs.

And, you call these ppl good traders...I know who they are as they have been banned in many forums.
Sadly, some are still not caught as it's very hard to prove their deeds.

I stand proud to say, I never sell watches that mis-claim a condition.
All my watches works fine.
I scrutize my items to the best of my ability which is not much.
I can put a case & bezel next to my watch with a 100x high powered loupe and compare the polished & brushed grain by grain.
My photos speak for myself.

These traders are still in business & u kind of guessed who they are when everything from them BNIB or LNIB.
U hardly see Pre-owned sale offer from them.

A very low profile but well known collector here was accidentally offered a BNIB watch by one of these trader here that's actually a pre-owned watch that he sold to a fren who later sold to this trader...it has e same miilesimation, LOL

Now, not all traders are bad.
Not all traders with good references are good.

Good traders dun even need to post to sale.
His watches are already sold even b4 they arrive.

My point here is how do u judge the pricing here from traders like these?
I exclude all these ppl from my pricing.
I visit em for e fun of knowing what these ppl have.

I offer every1 here my free service to come along w u if u need to buy from any grey-trader here...I can help u snuffed out who these traders are...
I am here to share...

[exxondus]

Told my friends PAM is a fashion watch... looks like I am right pricing falling due 2 no demand... kekekeke

PAM quality also cannot beat ROLEX or PTAEK... NO WAY!

guys, don start a war here Theres lots of useful info in this thread if you really are interested.

we brand followrs love our brand a lot so such statements is really not wanted. you can feel this way but maybe be a bit tactful cos here already a bit like a war zone liao

but honestly, demand is still there for PAM if you go ask the ADs.

[exxondus]

Fred, don mind me saying this and no offence intended to you or to anyone.

I read your later threads and understand that you mentioned you are a very straight person and don like to beat ard the bush and stuff like that.

And from the figures and facts that you posted, its very obvious that you are a very experienced trader and know a lot of stuff.

but its also true that you are not a person that tries to look at views/opinions from other people. anyone tht disagrees with you or feels differently, you put them down as not having the facts.

That I feel is really uncalled for. You can correct them and share your experience if you wish, but to call people arrogant and giving baseless facts, barking at wrong tree, is really a bit too attacking.

you have to first understand that a lot of forumers here are just buyers looking for a good deal. they arent traders like yourself and know the inside out of operations.

This thread has a title that PAM price is dropping.

As a buyer, I will think oh ya, really hor, now 5k can get preown 0, 9k can get 312 (pardon I only mention these 2 as like I said, I am a buyer and really don bother about other models that I have no interest in). that to me is really a price drop cos cheaper now. I don see how that could offend you that much that you need to attack me personally.

When I look at my GMTIIc prices in preown section, I am also sian to see it drop to 7.8k range where as ADs still selling at 9.5 with at most 5% discount. to me, its also a drop.

After which, I merely felt that it could be due to a influence by grey dealers as well as the way that ROLEX mass produces as compared to a more controlled porduction from PAM. As a buyer, of cos I wont know the figures like you. but I still believe there is some elemnt of truth in it regardless of how you want to correct me. I mean, why would i py 9,5k now that I know can get at 8k or less? this is of cos due to the fact that I am not that wealthy that 1.5k means nothing to me.

You also posted your own opinons that everyone in the world likes exclusivity in watches. To me, theres nothing wrong you felt that way but a lot of people doesntreally care that there are tons of POs out that and they still buy. Why, they like the watch. so yours is not a FACT pertaining to all, but its a FACT to some. hence, is it right to bash you on that? NO. its your views and we just learn to accept it.

This is a forum, let's not treat it like a war zone. personally, I still don understand how I could have offended you with my original post. Mayb I should have clicked qk reply rather than quoted what you said and mentioned how I felt about the situation currently in Singapore. Will reframe from accidentally quoting anything you post in future.

Finally, I have to agree to a large extent with Demo that no one knows everything tht is happening. even if you follow every PAM thingy, and document everything, I wont be surprised if a mere 1% escapes you.

anyway peace out.

[DM101]

Told my friends PAM is a fashion watch... looks like I am right pricing falling due 2 no demand... kekekeke

PAM quality also cannot beat ROLEX or PTAEK... NO WAY!

[Fred_Tan]

Yea, I agree

This strike another point.

Good bargain or good price is indeed good if you can get the watch. Some post low price, alot of response, and repost again and again. Test water, you know what I mean.

I have received emails from sellers who posted under different login name in many forums with same ip address try to post FS on watches they dun have with price that are way below mart....

Now, dun get me wrong here...this is an open economy.
Such practise is not illegal.

My point is, when we see FS price that are low with no pics, no phone number, just an email, and u always get respond that the item is already onhold even when u replied within seconds after e post was put up....we need to ignore these ppl....as their intent is to push price down...

From another group of ppl who are known as troll and moles in other forums, they are specifically hired & working with dealers to jack price up by posting WTB this & tat model....When u email them to make an offer, u get short replies that they have found a watch just seconds after they put up the post.
These same ppl could be putting FS posts at ridiculously high asking price...
The funny thing is they always say the watch is already onhold minutes after the post went up.
These ppl have pictures these days as all forums now require photos.

Also, this trolls & moles always put in good reference for that particular trader....when u see more 30+ responses to Reference request from members u have never seen that suddenly appear from nowhere....u gotta be careful....

Sadly, we cannot prove this.
All this are not wrong.

I strongly recommend that forums start to ask for prove of date in at least one photo with the watch....a photo of e watch with latest major newspaper as a backdrop can minimize this issue....

And for local SG-ROC, I think it's time we made phone numbers compulsary in all WFS & WTB post.
Also, I strongly urge the forum owners here to show IP address of all post to reduce these elements.
These action may not eliminate but at least reduce these cheats.